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From: "MikhailFedotov" <mikhail@kittown.com>
To: "'William Lovas'" <wlovas@stwing.upenn.edu>,
	"'Oliver Bandel'" <oliver@first.in-berlin.de>
Cc: <caml-list@inria.fr>
Subject: RE: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity
Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2003 13:13:29 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <003701c2ea12$5bde9560$a917a8c0@merann.ru> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20030313205010.GA7956@force.stwing.upenn.edu>

Hi!

> You're basic objection here is that O'Caml is not being
> taught in the same way that other programming languages have
> been taught in the past. Should it be?  Maybe O'Caml is
> different enough from other programming languages that it
> should be *taught* differently.

Key word is motivation. First visible results should be instant
and appealing in order to keep motivation. Simple programs
like "Hello world" are very important to keep motivation high.
All those samples ready to cut&paste.

As for the good practice, it's about simple tasks among the
more complex ones. The good example is "Concrete
Mathematics" by D.Knuth with its exercises, from trivial
to almost impossible - there is no single boring line.

If you forget about motivation to start (simple exersises), then it
doesn't really matter how sophiscated the language is by itself.

If you forget about motivation to progress (medum-difficulty
exersises, real tasks), then the reader will become bored.

If you forget about training how to use the language properly
for regular tasks (even just truncating the file after specified
position), then the reader will get the feeling of beautiful
academical language with no practical use. This is also
the case if all tasks were trivial and dedicated to learning
language constructs.

He will also become bored if someone will try to teach him
the theory behind the languge when all he wants is to learn
to use the language, preferrably by intuition (it is faster) using
examples.

As a summary:
1. Introduction.
2. Examples.
3. Reference manual with examples somewhere (not just grammar).

This is pretty enough... at least it works for me. :)

Mikhail


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  parent reply	other threads:[~2003-03-14 10:13 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 103+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2003-03-06 23:27 Graham Guttocks
2003-03-10 20:43 ` Paul Steckler
2003-03-10 23:48 ` Gerd Stolpmann
2003-03-11  0:18   ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-17 23:49   ` Graham Guttocks
2003-03-11  1:43 ` Nicolas Cannasse
2003-03-11 10:23   ` Pierre Weis
2003-03-11 14:27     ` Guillaume Marceau
2003-03-11 16:16       ` David Brown
2003-03-11 16:47       ` [Caml-list] about -rectypes Christophe Raffalli
2003-03-12  2:32       ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Nicolas Cannasse
2003-03-12  3:55         ` Cross-platform GUI (was Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity) mgushee
2003-03-12 10:51         ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Alex Romadinoff
2003-03-12 18:24         ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-11 19:02     ` Graham Guttocks
2003-03-12 17:12       ` Richard W.M. Jones
2003-03-12 18:08         ` Alwyn Goodloe
2003-03-12 22:34           ` Michael Schuerig
2003-03-12 23:13             ` Martin Weber
2003-03-12 23:35               ` Michael Schuerig
2003-03-13  8:02                 ` Alessandro Baretta
2003-03-13 10:23                   ` Michael Schuerig
2003-03-12 23:35             ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-12 23:18         ` Daniel Bünzli
2003-03-12 23:47           ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-13  2:15         ` William Lovas
2003-03-13  3:44           ` Graham Guttocks
2003-03-13  9:31           ` Richard W.M. Jones
     [not found]           ` <20030313095232.GC347@first.in-berlin.de>
2003-03-13 20:50             ` William Lovas
2003-03-13 21:17               ` Oliver Bandel
2003-03-13 22:01                 ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-13 22:17                 ` Oliver Bandel
2003-03-14  6:33                 ` Michal Moskal
2003-03-14 11:50                   ` Markus Mottl
2003-03-14 15:38                     ` Oliver Bandel
2003-03-14 10:13               ` MikhailFedotov [this message]
2003-03-14 10:30                 ` Johann Spies
2003-03-13  8:09       ` Pierre Weis
2003-03-15  1:43     ` Tushar Samant
2003-03-15  8:19       ` Andreas Eder
2003-03-11 16:26   ` Fred Yankowski
2003-03-11 19:47     ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity (long!) mgushee
2003-03-12 11:23       ` Diego Olivier Fernandez Pons
2003-03-30  5:59         ` Belated thanks (was Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity) Matt Gushee
2003-03-31 15:27           ` [Caml-list] Re: Belated thanks cashin
2003-04-01  8:22           ` Belated thanks (was Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity) Johann Spies
2003-03-12 20:41       ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity (long!) Max Kirillov
2003-03-13  2:36         ` Haskell-like syntax (was: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity (long!)) Oleg
2003-03-13 18:33           ` [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax Max Kirillov
2003-03-14 19:30             ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-14 19:47               ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-14 20:01               ` Seth Kurtzberg
2003-03-14 20:34                 ` brogoff
2003-03-14 21:17                   ` Sebastien Carlier
2003-03-14 21:51                     ` brogoff
2003-03-15  2:27                 ` Max Kirillov
2003-03-15 10:58                   ` Markus Mottl
2003-03-15 15:52                     ` [Caml-list] globally valid symbols (was: Haskell-like syntax) Max Kirillov
2003-03-15 20:16                     ` [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax David Brown
2003-03-16  5:28                     ` Module recursion (Was Re: [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax) brogoff
2003-03-16 11:10                       ` Markus Mottl
2003-03-16 18:02                         ` brogoff
2003-03-16 18:34                           ` Markus Mottl
     [not found]                     ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303152112560.27230-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-16  5:38                       ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-16 18:34                         ` brogoff
2003-03-17  2:20                           ` Jacques Garrigue
     [not found]                         ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303161020480.11736-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-17  5:08                           ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-17 17:06                             ` brogoff
2003-03-17 19:01                               ` Ville-Pertti Keinonen
     [not found]                             ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303170836240.29039-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-17 19:33                               ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-17 20:28                                 ` brogoff
     [not found]                                 ` <Pine.LNX.4.44.0303171145500.29039-100000@grace.speakeasy.n et>
2003-03-17 21:09                                   ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-19  2:34                                 ` [Caml-list] ocamlopt speed (was Re: Module recursion) Chris Hecker
2003-03-19 10:03                                   ` Michal Moskal
2003-03-19 10:38                                     ` Gerd Stolpmann
2003-03-19 20:36                                   ` Chris Hecker
2003-03-17  1:46                     ` [Caml-list] Re: Haskell-like syntax Nicolas Cannasse
2003-03-14 22:50               ` Oleg
2003-03-20 15:01                 ` Andreas Rossberg
2003-03-12 20:46       ` [Caml-list] Monads was OCaml popularity Christophe Raffalli
2003-03-13  0:03       ` [Caml-list] monads for dummies james woodyatt
2003-03-13  4:32         ` Christopher Quinn
2003-03-13 11:53         ` Christian Lindig
2003-03-12 18:59 ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Martin Weber
2003-03-12 20:24   ` Xavier Leroy
2003-03-13  8:57     ` [Caml-list] how to interface with integer Bigarrays using camlidl francois bereux
2003-03-13  9:36       ` Xavier Leroy
2003-03-13  0:42   ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Graham Guttocks
2003-03-12 17:40 isaac gouy
2003-03-12 23:53 [oliver: Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity] Oliver Bandel
2003-03-13  1:34 ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Michael Schuerig
2003-03-13  7:09 Daniel M. Albro
2003-03-13 16:48 ` Neel Krishnaswami
2003-03-13 21:29 ` Karl Zilles
2003-03-13 21:36   ` Daniel M. Albro
2003-03-13 21:42   ` Daniel M. Albro
     [not found]     ` <15985.1204.814698.939943@h00045a4799d6.ne.client2.attbi.com>
2003-03-14  5:49       ` Daniel M. Albro
2003-03-14  9:05         ` Ville-Pertti Keinonen
2003-03-14  9:13           ` Daniel M. Albro
2003-03-13 21:53   ` Brian Hurt
2003-03-13 14:39 [oliver: Re: [Caml-list] OCaml popularity] Oliver Bandel
2003-03-13 16:35 ` [Caml-list] OCaml popularity Michael Schuerig
2003-03-14 22:14 Daniel M. Albro
2003-03-15 16:27 Oliver Bandel
2003-03-15 17:55 ` Sergey Goldgaber

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